You weren't in it either.

No need to have 2 threads about exactly the same thing is there? As I'm the only one who's contributed to this one, you may as well get rid of it, Mr Sedegbeer.

(not that i'm trying to tell u your job)

See, someone else ignores what I write.

Typical Jon! Got in while I was trying to say that no-one else had posted to this thread.

I'm not a regular or memorable enough contributor to get a mention in any coprse rants. And I'm not angling for one either btw.

You did write for Weekending once. That's more than they've done.

Also Huddlines, Smith & Jones, Comedy Nation and 2 series of a radio sitcom for BBC Wales. There. I've blown my own trumpet now.

...was shit

>...was shit

The shows I wrote for?

If you're gonna attack them at least say something better than that timid little '...was shit'. That's weedy. Sounds like you quite like them, really. I don't blame you. There were some good bits in all those shows. My bits, of course. Haha I'm the best, not you.

I think he meant the "SOTCAA was shit" thread was itself shit.

>I think he meant the "SOTCAA was shit" thread was itself shit.

That's how I read it too.

Having said that, Week Ending was shit at the end, but I think most people are in agreement over that and it didn't stop me submitting stuff to it which never made it to the air. For Some Reason.

bitter sheep
sweet cow

>
>Having said that, Week Ending was shit at the end, but I think most people are in agreement over that and it didn't stop me submitting stuff to it which never made it to the air. For Some Reason.

For someone who worked on the fag-end of 'Weekending' as grim twilight settled on the land of Sally Grace flavoured-satire, let me say that the end of the show didn't really distinguish itself as 'shit'.

WeekEnding was ALWAYS patchy. The huge amount of inexperienced writers; the fact it was on 36 weeks a year, the simple fact that there was no real affection to the show; not like with 'The Huddlines', all that contributed to a very rough-and-ready listening experience.

My writing partner found some old tapes of the show some four years before we started worked on it, and the quality of writing was variable, to say the least. If anything, the writing in the last year of the show was more consistant than it had been for some time, it was just James Boyle bringing the badness of WE to the attention of the world that made everyone think the quality had nosedived.

In reality, it had meandered its mediocre way for decades until it was well, well past it's sell-by date.

I still remember the day the head of Light Entertainment went out to the barn with his gun, and we heard the single shot *sob*.

I think you're right about the "shit" comment being directed towards the thread rather that list of shows, on reflection. After finally having owned up to what I've written I was on the defensive, to say the least!

I thought the "SOTCAA was shit" thread was amazing. The way it builds is beautiful, piling up layer upon layer of bile until those two cadaverous rednames appear at the end and the SOTCAA logo punches you in the face. It's like a tightly cut film trailer, complete with coda (the Brooker gag at the end). I am pleased.

And the person who did me was good too.

Reading through this thread again a couple of things are worthy of comment.
Firstly, regardless of whether TGP is any good or not (I've only seen one and I thought it was fairly average) has it occurred to Mike, Joe and Rob that everyone disagreed with Steven because they disagreed with him. That's not bullying or fascism - it's simply the fact that his views aren't very cogent. His fearless opinion expressing skills are often simply saying TGP/modern music/black and asian comedians are shit. No surprise when people tear this kind of thing to shreds for the ill-thought out nonsense it is.

Secondly, the 'opinions' that are praised coming from Steven are apparently different from those expressed by Mogwai, George, Jon, Ewar and the rest. Why? Because they disagree with you about TGP and Steven doesn't? Who's trying to surpress opinion now?

Obviously you alll have a reputation as no-quarter-given, mad as hell, comedy critics who attack the complacency and smugness of the modern TV 'comedy', and you may be expecting people to regard the thread, like your calls for direct action, as self-mocking humour. But it isn't. Reading it again it seems even more nasty, personal and unfair. Caricaturing people who have kept the forum debates going (even if you might have disliked the way they did it) and desperately trying to purge any possible remnants of alleged 'cosiness' between you and Herring seems pointless and pathetic given the quality and excellence of your site in its previous incarnation.

You will, of course never apologize for any offence caused, deliberately or otherwise. Fair enough when dealing with the BBC, or Talkback or other media institutions. Unfair, and unacceptable, when dealing with people on the forum whose chief crime appears to be disagreeing with someone who couldn't argue their way out of a paper bag, but happens to hate TGP.

Ah well. Am still looking forward to the site's return.

"His fearless opinion expressing skills are often simply saying TGP/modern music/black and asian comedians are shit."

Al, that is obviously wrong, and is just generalising again. I never said TGP is shit, I wanted to say it, but I waited through 6 or 7 episodes before writing my impressions of it, and never went out and said it was shit.

Also saying I think Black and Asian comedy is complete crap is.. err well complete crap, and is trying to insinuate I am a racist. I said I thought Goodness Gracious Me and The Real McCoy were crap, that is a completely different thing, and you are just twisting my words, I also think the 11 o Clock Show is crap, does that mean I'm anti-Caucasion too?

I don't necessarily think moderm music is crap, but I think modern promotion of music is. The only music you get on the TV and Radio and in the charts today *IS* 99.9% utter complete shite. And all this crap music is force fed into the ears of everyone growing up these days, so they have to develop their tastes within this music group. You can't expect a 10 year old kid to go into a dusty 2nd hand record store and pick out old classic records at random without hearing them, judging them on their covers, they're going to buy whatever they like out of the only choice they hear/see in the modern media. Therefore most young people today like complete crap things like Robbie Williams, West Life, Backstreet Boys, Britney Spears, Ricky Martin, the Spice Girls etc etc et fucking cetera... all talentless vacuous toss, but raking in the money and being treated like serious artists, it is disgusting. Good music is still being produced, albeit on a tiny scale worldwide, but it is not being advertised in the foreground, there is simply no call for it, business doesn't need to find any rare struggling underground band who would be volatile and expensive to produce, when they can make their own fabricated group by advertising in Dance School magazines, and pick some worthless people they can control the image and music of to the rate of 100%, have employed company songwriters churn out bland and formulaic 'pop' songs that are guaranteed to presuade a few million idiots to buy their next single, and they can milk as much money as they can out of their own little synthetic gravy train. Who needs talent anymore, when you can get straight to the money and avoid all the trouble, fucking hell..

Steven is right. I'm not going to buy CDs of current bands any more as they're all crap. All of them, you hear me, ALL of them!!! And they're evil and have sex with animals.
I've checked Steven's statistics and his percentages are 100, 000% right.
I'll only only buy the work of dead guitarists rom now on as nothing worthy has been produced since the 60s (with the exception of Radiohead, and they haven't sold out even thought hey do promote themselves commercially, it's different, ok?) Yeah, so maybe the live music scene will die, but who cares? That way nobody will make any more horrible evil music. It'll be worth it.

Actually, Steven, there was a top article in one of our weekend papers which would do your heart good. There has been a massive upsurge in the success and exposure of local bands who would normally have been classed as indie or alternative.
Mostly this is due to a national radio station here called Triple J - it's the youth arm of the Australian Broadcasting Corporation and covers practically the entire nation - 19 million. American record company execs are frequently amazed that a single station can provide a national profile to otherwise unknown acts. Triple J holds an "Unearthed" competition where they scour the country (including tiny little outback towns) for up and coming bands. Recent winners include Killing Heidi (who scooped the pool at the ARIA awards) and silverchair - product of the grunge years who have played massive gigs in the Americas (huge in Brazil, bizarrely). Placebo supported THEM last time they toured.
I'll look up the Triple J website and leave it on this thread for you. I think you'd like what they do.

Great, more sarcasm. To show you an example of the idiocy of the media, someone showed me a recent article from the NME, I can't remember the name of the woman who wrote it, but that's probably all for the best.

It basically said John Lennon was shit, and was completely untalented, and the best thing he ever did was shoot himself (great research there..) The entire article was completely full of insults, and it went on to say the Beatles were shit too. I could imagine the person who wrote it saying "Do you see what I've done here? I'm not praising the Beatles like everyone else does, no, I'm actually calling them shit.. yeah that's right.. I'm controversial me..)

Please don't give me any of that crap about "Oh I'm not going to buy a single ever again, because Steven says all moderm music is rubbish." So you're saying that the British charts aren't completely full of crap and have lots of talent in them? Please do inform me oh master of taste what amazingly talented musicians are in the charts right now, I would love to know.

Actually if you look at Radiohead's advertising, all they've done is a 1 second advert that just says Radiohead and that's it. They don't need to show you nice studio photographs of the band members tarted up with little quotes about how good the album is from the media. They're at least giving to viewer the respect to work things out.

I don't own their album, and I doubt I ever will, because their last album which I did buy was a little downhill from the last, even though the press all fawned over it, because it was the 'fashion' at the time, this album isn't amazing either, but has at least 3-4 decent songs on it, yet the press call it total shite and then review another West Life product with good marks.. fucking hell.

> this album isn't amazing either, but has at least 3-4 decent songs on it, yet the press call it total shite and then review another West Life product with good marks.. fucking hell.

Which papers are you reading, Steven?

Somehow this thread has become all about Steven's views again - not the point at all.

Sorry, Steven. I didn't mean to misrepresent your views. BUT:
a) Describing a comedy show as 'racist' may not be describing it as 'shit' but it's hardly a compliment is it?
b) You DID say - outright - all modern music is no good, except Radiohead, Supergrass, and Pearl Jam.
c) Didn't follow the TGP arguments too closely - but you were highly derogatory about TGP. (Which you have every right to be.)

My whole point was the foolishness of SOTCAA holding your points up as some example of brave fearless debating against the more measured comments of someone like Jon. You yourself have admitted your points are often poorly expressed, or written in a hurry. I'm not trying to have a go at you - just the unfairness of the SOTCAA is Shit thread.

>a) Describing a comedy show as 'racist' may not be describing it as 'shit' but it's hardly a compliment is it?
>b) You DID say - outright - all modern music is no good, except Radiohead, Supergrass, and Pearl Jam.
>c) Didn't follow the TGP arguments too closely - but you were highly derogatory about TGP. (Which you have every right to be.)

Well Al, I do think GGM and TRM weren't very good anyway, I'm not particularly annoyed by the racism in GGM, which admittedly there isn't that much of, there was a lot more in TRM I think, but it's simply the fact that I doubt a White show would be able to get away with such things, and simply letting a minority get away with it because they probably come under more racism than anybody is avoiding the point.

About the other point, I actually only own 2 Radiohead albums and a few singles, and nothing by Supergrass at all. But both these bands are obviously very talented, and put on a very good live show. I haven't seen anybody else currently going who can compare to them, there are other bands like the Stereophonics or Travis, but I think personally they are boring and bland, but they do play faithfully live, which is more you can say for most other chart successes.
I think we should avoid talking about music in here anyway, as it is obvious my views are not compatible with the majority of people in here, and is just causing even more hatred.

About TGP, I waited until the 4th or 5th episode to post my comments, which were only AFTER Richard Herring asked for everyones views on the program. I posted my views, Herring and Murray didn't really answer them and just basically twisted a tiny point of my entire opinion to fit their distorted answers, this is what made me bring up the subject again and again, if he hadn't of done this, perhaps my first message would of been the only one.

Richard Herring has taken umbrdige on the Lee and Herring guestbook about people using his name on this board and posting offensive comments that could be taken seriously by someone (obviously meaning me).
I don't find the comments offensive at all, the first time I saw the thread it was obviously a piss take, and on the face of it, looks as if it is all against me, because of the obvious insults direct towards me all the way through. But obviously is actually in defence of me, I do agree with the parody, and yeah it was probably to piss some people off more than anything, but this place is so boring most of the time you might as well have some things to spice up the conversation.

I mean, it obviously seems that the Corpses agree with me on this one. But saying that it is irrelevant because of my other views is silly. I agree with a lot of what the Corpses say, but disagree with certain opinions of theirs.. it doesn't mean I think they're wrong, just that I can see their points and they are valid, but I don't think the same way they do. And I'm sure they can see the same in some of my opinions.

I don't necesserily go out of my way to piss people off here, though it obvious looks that way most of the time. But I have quite strong opinions about such things as music etc. But that's what this forum is for, debate about opinions, if you want everyone around you to agree with you why don't you become Zoe Ball.

I think it's funny that people are annoyed that Steven constantly expresses his views in a lengthy and vocal manner, when all he is doing is defending himself from postings which are directed at him.

I also think Steven makes way more sense than pretty much everyone on this forum.

I also think its sort of pointless to argue about music, but people seem to like doing it so I guess that's fair enough.,

I forgot to mention that I think the "SOTCAA was shit" thread was fucking hilarious.

After the Corpses' recent TVGH effort I posted something to the effect that we should all watch for their next stab at cyber-terrorism: a fearless and biting satire of their very own TV Forum. This was meant to be a statement which positively dripped with sarcasm, as they'd done precisely that some months before. However, in a kind of double bluff - "They won't be expecting us to actually *do* it, heh heh heh" - they've gone ahead and done it again. What are they going to parody next - the blurb on their Cornflakes packets?

Also, to set the record a little straighter, I never claimed that "SOTCAA was shit" - the number of my friends to whom I raved about the bloody thing would testify to that - all I have been saying recently is that they're a bad-tempered couple of buggers who tend to waste their energy on venomous but limp pastiches for an audience of twenty when they could be achieving a damn sight more by concentrating on what they're good at. And over the last week they've done nothing to prove me wrong.

Of course they might just have chosen to go down this threadbare parody route again out of "irony" - although it's becoming clear that they have about as much grasp of what that means as Alanis fucking Morrisette.

>I think it's funny that people are annoyed that Steven constantly expresses his views in a lengthy and vocal manner, when all he is doing is defending himself from postings which are directed at him.
>
>I also think Steven makes way more sense than pretty much everyone on this forum.
>
>I also think its sort of pointless to argue about music, but people seem to like doing it so I guess that's fair enough.,


As I thought I'd explained, but obviously not clearly enough, my points above were not levelled at, or about, Steven. They are about the attitude of SOTCAA to certain people on thius forum. Personally, I do not find unjustified insults 'fucking hilarious'.

For the record, I have no problem with Steven posting per se. I have had, and continue to have problems with some of what he has said.

yeah, very good, i'm sure. Can we just have the site again now?

Sorry Steven, don't wish to cause you offence. I'm just genuinely amazed that you generalise to the degree which you do about there being no good music.
I have no idea about the British charts as I'm not in Britain.
Maybe things DO seem as dire as you indicate. If so, I'm sorry for all of you.

I hear plenty of music that is up to scratch just because of the nature of radio stations we have over here. Besides crap commercial stations and national youth broadcaster Triple J, we also have 'community radio stations'. These are non-commercially owned, non-government owned stations where people present their own shows using their own records. No payment, which means that the shows are presented by people who truly love music and who have developed amazing record collections.

Look up the Triple J website - there's MP3s
http://www.abc.net.au/triplej/triplej.htm

The things I like tend to be Australian, such as Powderfinger, You Am I, Regurgitator, Spiderbait...they're not necessarily the be-all and end-all of music but they're not bad.
Actually, I take that back - Regurgitator are fantastic and I thoroughly recommend you investigate further. Kinda techno art-rock/intellectual synth-pop/sarcastic wise-arse disco thrash trash with a distinctly non-corporate stance.
Powderfinger play the sort of cred indie rock which I think (from looking at your other preferences) you would like.
Other things on regular rotation at my place include US trash band Supersuckers, Nick Cave, Ed Kuepper,and the new Shirley Bassey remix album.

Hmm, we may have to start up a music exchange programme for you Steven.

OK .. I give up.

Don't be so defeatist, Al!

Let's stay around and piss the living hell out of everyone, like I ususally do anyway!

I think Mike and Joe need to go outside and kick a few puppies rather than spewing their venom over the very people that have supported them.

No, it's not "parody", it's fucking lame. I wish they'd get back to doing what they're good at and what got them attention in the first place because they were doing it so WELL.


just my $0.02

...and if I were feeling combative I would point out that the "poor man's Bill Bailey" jibe is tantamount to an actionable accusation of plagiarism, but I'm not that insecure, so fuck it. Bill's a good bloke and if he thinks there's room for two long-haired musical comics on the planet then it's none of anybody else's business.
And if saying "Bill's a good bloke" is name-dropping, then that brings me to why I've never mentioned being in the BBBs with Iain lee; it's just never been particularly relevant to the topic under discussion (I'm one of those deluded individuals who actually thinks the threads are supposed to be themed rather than just places to trade insults). Shall I declare all my tenuous minor-celeb connections now to avoid further confusion? I was at college with the Scottish guy off thge Vodafone ads, happy now?

>I've never mentioned being in the BBBs with Iain lee; it's just never been particularly relevant to the topic under discussion

The Undead probably thought you were keeping quiet about it on account of Lee's position as Forum Enemy No. 1 (itself simply because we'd never before seen someone so inexplicably smug about their own appalling performance). If you really were keeping schtum to avoid any flak turning your way, it was probably a smart move.


>(I'm one of those deluded individuals who actually thinks the threads are supposed to be themed rather than just places to trade insults).

You new here, Mitch?


>I was at college with the Scottish guy off the Vodafone ads

Did he sound exactly like Ewan MacGregor then, too?

>I was at college with the Scottish guy off the Vodafone ads

I find that strangely impressive.

I find Mitch Benn impressive for
a) being alive(an accomplishment the dead do not have)
b)being able to play guitar (is very very hard [trust me])
c)emailing me (a nutter/a complete freak)

I find Nash impressive for...


.


.


...no...


.


.


...no, wait, i'll get it in a minute...


.


.


...hang on...


.


.


...no, there's not much. But he once made a joke.

>b)being able to play guitar (is very very hard [trust me])

Piece of piss

It even harder to play a piece of piss. No strings, you see.

>>b)being able to play guitar (is very very hard [trust me])
>Piece of piss
...okay rephrased:
to play the guitar well and with that much skill and dedication and composure and accuracy is very hard[trust me]

better?

Anyone can play guitar.

...but we choose not to because, like, you know, guitars are so yesterday and anyway Aphex Twin never used them.

Ziggy played guitar.

Hey! People leapt to my defence! I'm genuinely moved.
Thing about Iain Lee is, having worked with him back when he was allowed to write his own material, I happen to know how genuinely funny he can be. The fact that he usually came across as appallingly smug and complacent on 11OCS is more down to the fact that 11OCS is (was?) an appallingly smug and complacent show.
I was actually on the initial shortlist to present the pilot run of 11OCS back in 98 (he's name-dropping again) and it was never intended to be that way... the idea was that after having seen the news at 9 on BBC1(as was), at 10 on ITV (as was) and then 10.30 on BBC2, the independently minded punter would turn to 4 at 11pm and see the same news dissected in a witty and incisive manner. It was supposed to be a TW3 for the 21st century...the fact that it ended up being a non-ironic Beavis and Butthead ("Hur hur hur. He said pearl necklace. Hur hur") is actually a damn shame.

Oh, and yes, Hamish (Vodafone guy) has always sounded like that. Even if the rise of EmcG has created a bit of a vogue for cute Scottish guys which may have helped H's career just recently, it's not like he's jumping a bandwagon or anything.

I could relate the whoe story of the Bootleg Bootleg Beatles, but it's a bit long and tedious...

Go on, we're all sitting comfortably. Well I am anyway.

You sure about this? I wasn't being self-effacing, it really is a long and boring story...

>Thing about Iain Lee is, having worked with him back when he was allowed to write his own material, I happen to know how genuinely funny he can be.

But he was still annoying on that Comedy Lab thing he did recently.
And I agree on 11ocs, it could (should?) have been great - if only they'd change the target audience. Still, it's Dead Ringers tonight! Yay!

>And I agree on 11ocs, it could (should?) have been great - if only they'd change the target audience.

This would normally be the point where one or other of the Corpses would contribute a long post along the lines of: BUT WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT IT!!!!???

Perhaps not with as many exclamation marks, mind.

Cheerio

>It was supposed to be a TW3 for the 21st century...

What is this supposed to mean? Anything which intends to emulate another show is missing the point of it's existence.

>>It was supposed to be a TW3 for the 21st century...
>
>What is this supposed to mean? Anything which intends to emulate another show is missing the point of it's existence.
>

No, I just meant it was supposed to be as fresh and subversive NOW as TW3 had been then. Probably a doomed exercise, but it's stll a shame it missed by quite such a wide margin.

>I just meant it was supposed to be as fresh and subversive NOW as TW3 had been then.

A crap analogy then?