Film/VT Posted Sat May 27 12:57:12 BST 2000 by Paul

Does anyone know if there is anyway you can convert home videos to that kind of film look that the BBC broadcast Casualty in a few years back ? I presume when the BBC broadcast VT and make it look like film, it is a simple case of just changing the look of the picture (ie, it doesn't have to be recorded any differently ??) I personally don't like this on programmes as it is so obvious that when you see 'treated VT', but I wondered if anyone knows of any gadgets or places that will convert home videos to this kind of look ?


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Jo_ham on Sat May 27 20:44:12 BST 2000:

it's a technique called field removed video.

it can be done on most edit suites using a mixer of some description (or using a non-linear system such as Media 100 or Avid).

you could broadcast it straight from a tape via a mixer - but I doubt this would be done - it would be less hassle to do a copy of the master (or make the master with this dire effect in the first place)


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Cardinal Biggles on Sun May 28 16:56:00 BST 2000:

Uh... does that mean we can't achieve it with our camcorder and a video recorder...?


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Paul on Sun May 28 17:08:33 BST 2000:

>Uh... does that mean we can't achieve it with our camcorder and a video recorder...?

Yeah .. I dunno - still none the wiser !


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Jo_ham on Sun May 28 17:33:46 BST 2000:

heh!

sorry!

errrrrrrrr dunno.

I expect that some camcorders will have it as a gimmick effect.

A VCR won't do it as such - you would need a mixer to produce the effect and then run it back to tape (you would need 2 VCRs).


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Cardinal Biggles on Sun May 28 18:40:51 BST 2000:

*buys second vcr*

Now how owuld I do it...?


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Nik on Fri Jun 2 08:45:29 BST 2000:

Never mind how, just don't! :)


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Nik on Fri Jun 2 08:48:33 BST 2000:

....although, I think if you have a camcorder with a progressive scan setting, that should give a similar effect. Not much use for existing recordings though.


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By subbes on Fri Jun 2 15:12:29 BST 2000:

See, now that one made sense.

wouldnt wantto do it, unless somoene paid me huge amounts of money for it.







Yes, about 15p.


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Gareth on Thu Jun 8 13:19:49 BST 2000:

>*buys second vcr*

>Now how owuld I do it...?

You don't, not just with camcorders and VCRs.

A single frame of TV is made up of two interlaced fields. At its simplest and crudest, "film effect" is achieved by removing the second field and replacing it with a copy of the first. You can only do this with specialised video effects equipment or software.


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By subbes on Thu Jun 8 15:45:55 BST 2000:

Okay, thankyou.

finally someone explains it so i know what they're on about.


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Jo_ham on Thu Jun 8 20:18:33 BST 2000:

the progressive scan would work - but it was primarily intended to be used to shoot television screens and computer monitors.

using the regular method, if the screen was out of phase then you got the flickering effect, or the slow moving lines, depending on just how much out of kilter the camera and the screen were.

the progressive scan, having no vertical refresh rate (or one that is so high that it makes no odds) clears this.

but it does look a bit odd.


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By subbes on Fri Jun 9 17:23:54 BST 2000:

...does anyone have a phrasebook for techie-speak...?


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Jo_ham on Fri Jun 9 19:54:44 BST 2000:

just smile and nod usually works.... :O)

progressive scanning is something developed for use on Betacam cameras (and higer models) - they didn't have it on U-matic ones.

instaad of shooting with the two fields separately at 50HZ, the camera takes the whole CCD surface as one frame (ie, like one frame of film)

this does mean that the first and second fields will be identical however and causes problems when played back on a monitor with interlaced fields.


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By subbes on Fri Jun 9 20:24:43 BST 2000:

so... it just puts the two together in a bag and shakes them?

like thje topping on popcorn?


Subject: Re: Film/VT [ Previous Message ]
Posted By Gareth on Mon Jun 12 12:34:20 BST 2000:

>the progressive scan would work - but it
>was primarily intended to be used to shoot
>television screens and computer monitors.

Erm, no - modern DigiBeta cameras do not use progressive scan. They simply have shutter speeds that are adjustable to the point where they can shoot computer monitors without flicker. And you don't need progressive scan to shoot an ordinary TV screen; you just set the shutter speed to 1/50 (all professional cameras can do this).

>this does mean that the first and second
>fields will be identical however and causes
>problems when played back on a monitor with
>interlaced fields.

Er, no - the fields may be identical, but they are still interlaced, so no problem.

It's worth pointing out that progressive scan is *not* used professionally by UK broadcasters. Even the very highest-end professional camera and monitor uses interlaced fields at 50Hz (none of these domestic 100Hz gimmicks).

When the UK finally moves to HDTV, progressive scan cameras, monitors and ancillary equipment will start to gain currency, but not until then.


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